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Sweet Dreams: How Much Sleep Does Your Baby Really Need?
How much sleep does your precious your child REALLY need? Ah, yes, the elusive world of baby sleep can feel like a mysterious puzzle.
Over the first couple of years, we witness a beautiful dance of evolving sleep needs, both during the day and night. From those early newborn days of round-the-clock snoozing to the gradual shift towards more consolidated nighttime sleep, it's a journey filled with surprises.
Daytime naps transform from frequent catnaps to more structured, predictable routines, while nighttime sleep gradually extends into those glorious stretches of uninterrupted rest. Yet, just when we think we've mastered the art of sleep, new milestones, teething troubles, or developmental leaps can shake things up once again. It's a testament to the incredible growth and development happening and a gentle reminder that flexibility and patience are keys when navigating this ever-changing sleep journey together.
How Much Sleep Does Your Child Need
I have put together a free Get your Ages and Stages Sleep Guidelines that shows what you should aim for night sleep, day sleep and how many naps.
If your child already has their sleep skills, their ability to “bounce back” to consolidated sleep after a regression is faster and easier.If you are struggling more than 2 weeks with regression behavior, it's time for a sleep tune-up call to get things back on track ASAP!
The Power of a Sleep Tune Up Call:
Remember, creating a nurturing sleep environment and establishing a consistent bedtime routine can work wonders in helping your little one get the restful, rejuvenating sleep they need to grow and thrive.
Here's to peaceful nights, bright mornings, and the joy of watching your little one drift off to sleep.
Are you struggling with your child’s sleep? Are you looking for alternatives to cry it out methods?
The first step to see if I can help you achieve beautiful, blissful sleep is to schedule a 60 minute ZOOM sleep strategy session. Go to this link and complete the contact me form and I will be in touch within 24 hours with directions on how to schedule your Sleep Strategy Session.
If you are still wondering if I can help, please know I do NOT advocate 'cry-it-out'. I am a Gentle Sleep Coach. If you want to learn about my guilt-free and gentle process, please go to these links.
The Blissful Baby Stairway to Sleep
Please join my Sleep is Bliss Tribe in Facebook, Instagram and LinkedIn so we can stay connected and you can continue to get amazing resources on sleep and family wellness.
Sleep is Bliss, Let's Get you more!
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Okay. I'm here with Christie and we're kind of doing our brainstorming session for our interview. Okay. So let's go ahead and go back in time. Remind me how old, remind me how old your child was when you first contacted me. Probably four months. Okay. And how did you remember how you heard about me? Yes, my mom actually found you,
so, oh, yeah. My mom, my mom doing her research found you and said, I, you know, we should reach out to you. So it was my mom that actually found you. Oh my gosh. And did you, why was she researching for you At that time? You know, obviously four months being a new mom, I had no idea what I was doing,
so we were struggling with our little one because I couldn't put him down every time I would put him down. Like he wouldn't stay asleep for me. So that was the battle of like, what do I do? And it, I, I'm sure as any new mom Googling Yeah. Or reading, it's just so overwhelming that you just, you know where That is.
That, okay. So we're definitely gonna wanna say that. So like, actually let me, let me just preface like, kind of the typical format so that you'll kind of understand the, the general flow of these so that then we can kind of like, I can get some of the details. So usually what I do is I introduce and I say,
you know, I'm Joanna and I'm here with Christie, and I don't say your child's name 'cause I almost wanna keep it, I wanna keep you and the, the child's name anonymous if you know, if you want to. Okay. And I'll, and I'll say, you know, she's here to talk about her story of how she has been supported by me through all these really important stages of her child's life.
And then, so then I'll say, okay, so Christie, how did you find me? So you would be like, you'd say something like, my, you know, my child was four months, first time mom, this kid would, if I got him to sleep, he would not stay asleep. I was upset, frantic, I was Googling like a maniac.
So I think that that is really important to be like, it was like I was addicted to the Google. Oh, yeah. Trying all these different weird things. And finally my mom is like, let me, let me do some research, which I think is super cool. 'cause like, you have this image, like, this is every mom story.
I've got this new baby. Yeah. Nothing's working. So you're over here going la la la Oh, God's over here seeing you struggle. Right. But she Doesn't normally know what to do either, because she's kind of like, it's, I mean, yeah. 30 plus years ago, I mean, she, she's not gonna remember. And I mean,
she's still working as well, so it's not like she can drop what she's doing to come and help me. So yeah, this was only solution she could find in, in, in helping her child. So, yeah. Exactly. So that's awesome. So then Grandma found me, and then now remind me what happened next then. Yeah. So at that four months,
the information you gave me and my husband was amazing knowing like nothing was gonna help the situation until we practiced the, the, the roll, the tummy rollings, he needed to roll from front to back each side. And by that point, as we got closer, six months is when I started the actual crib training. And took a while, obviously.
But by then it was amazing. I was able to put him in, he was able to sell Soze Yeah. And put himself to sleep. Yeah. 'cause again, some things that I was doing wasn't working. So that's when you, I think you were the one that helped me kind of like, you know, making sure he didn't have anything in the crib except for some ies I did play some music to help soothe him.
Yeah. Okay. So let me tell you, just change subject for a second. That painting behind you is exquisite. Oh, Thank you. What Is that? My, it's actually my grandpa painted, he was a ceramics professor over at, in, at a college in Colorado. And this was one of his pieces when he was in college that he had to paint.
So thank you so much, Cheryl. I'll let you, It's so beautiful. And who, who, who is it of, who's the person? Just one of his models. Student's, daughters. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Look at the, look at the light. The way the light is. Like, it, it just,
Yeah. Really? Yeah, It was one of my, it was actually one of mine. And my, my one, my grandfather passed. I was surprised. A lot of people didn't really want a lot of his pieces, but my husband was just like, we're taking this one. And I was like, sold. So, yeah. Okay.
Well, thank you. I And that was your grandfather, huh? Yeah, he, Yeah, he paint. Yeah, he painted it. So That's amazing. Right? Yeah. So now you have like, his living art with you that's really special. Oh Yeah. Plus It's just so soothing. It's just so, Oh, yeah. Which is hence why I kind of keep it right there.
'cause my desk is right where I'm sitting, so like I can turn and have like a little minute of like A little minute. I love it. It's so beautiful. Yeah. Yeah. Thank You. Yeah. That's Really fun. I didn't, I didn't get any art in my blood, so I kinda Yeah, I know. It's kind of amazing when you're like,
wait, there's art in my blood, but I don't, I didn't get it. 'cause there's, and my grandfather was a really famous cinematographer. Oh wow. He did the, the original miracle on 34th Street, the black and white one. That's so divine. Oh my gosh. Oh Yeah. And if you haven't seen that movie in a long time,
the original, Oh my. It's the Most just the plot line and the dialogue and the nuance. Like, they just don't make movies like that anymore. Not only because they're just so beautiful. Yeah. But the, the, the writing, the, the, the nuance, the dialogue that, that the, the, I mean, just, just way more,
just more sophisticated, but, but nice. But then the, the, the cinematography is ex is is amazing because he had to go to New York in December to do all the cinematography. And so that Macy's Day parade that was in the movie was actually the Macy's Day parade that year or whatever. He had to go in November. But y you know what I'm saying?
So in other words, they, they didn't have all the sophistication of Not all the technology rain, Winter and create, you know, like we can't, now they can just go sh show up in a desert to make it snow. But back then, like, you had to take real time, real perspective, real streets, real people, real offices,
and then create Oh yeah, my sister, who you've met, she's a photographer and she still likes to take pictures with film instead of digital. So yeah, I totally, because like, she'll tell me time, she's like, I need to capture the light at this time and da, da da. So yeah. I, I get you. Yeah.
Again, I have a lot of artsy people in my family. Totally. It skipped me, but I totally understand the concept. 'cause listening to them talk about their crafts and everything. Yeah. That's so cool. So what is your, remind me your sister's Name? Tory. Okay. And what's her last name? Abeta. A VAB as in boy,
EYTA. Got it. And so I didn't know she was a photographer. What, like, what kind? Like she Freelances. So she does a lot of like, model stuff. Yeah. She's been doing that for the past couple of years. So, and then she'll cool. Yeah. Yeah. So she does really good stuff. Wow. Where does she live?
Here and there. She Travels a lot. Okay. Yeah, because she literally is Yeah. Yeah. She shows up for the gig. Yes. Shows up for the gig. Yeah. She mostly is in New York, but I mean, she travels so often. Like, she just came back from London not too long ago. So Yeah. She travels a lot.
Wow. That's kind of fun. You can live vicariously. I know. No joke. All right. So anyway, so, so, okay. So circling back. So like, again, the first question's gonna be like, how'd you find me? So we're gonna kinda like, set the stage. Okay. My child was four months. He wasn't sleeping.
I was a Google mania. My grand grandma felt like powerless because it was 30, you know, so then we found Joanna, and then we did a sleep strategy session. 'cause that's what you did. Yes. And Then you can say that, that, so what I wanna emphasize when we talk about the sleep strategy session is why that was valuable to you at that time.
Not so much what I told you to do, but why that helped you there. You were a new mom with a four month old who wasn't sleeping. Why was talking to a sleep expert so important? I think for me it was the guidance. It's like, I, I will do whatever I need to, to help my child, but I just need the guidance.
I, I literally need someone to tell me what to do. 'cause it's the overwhelming of like so many, so much information that you, you can read. But, but being able to physically talk to someone was what I think was the most helpful for me. The step by step, like step one, step two, step three, step four,
like that was what helped me. And what I think helped me get to like, okay, I can do this. Like, okay, I love that. Yeah. The panic, the fear, like the fact that I was able to verbally talk to someone and they were able to tell me like, these are the steps you need to take to help your kiddo.
Like, that was what was reassuring for me. Like the, the weight was off my shoulders. Like I, okay, that is amazing. That's exactly what you need to say. You need to say like, I had so much panic and fear to that, that that, that the, the reading or the talking to other friends Yes. Was dating more panic and fear and to then be able to speak to a sleep expert who was really willing to listen to what was happening specifically with me and my child with husband attending.
Yes. That's a big one. Because, you know, that's my, like, that's part of my business model. I pretty much no longer allow a mom to do this alone. So dad has to be involved in the process at some point. So especially if they're a one-on-one client, like they have to be at the sleep strategy session. They have to be at the consult,
they have to be on the call on nights one, two, three, four. And then maybe I might phase 'em out. Yeah. But I have made it very much like that. Getting on the same page with your partner is critical because it's not something for you as mother to figure out a loan. Understandable. Yeah. You know? Yeah. So yeah. So we said,
okay, so I'll say, you know, why was the sleep surgery session so important to you? And then you can say, well, I had a lot of fear and panic. I needed to speak to somebody. I need the specific guidance for me and my situation. I needed my husband to hear it. Yes. So we could be on the same page.
I needed to physically ask questions. I needed the step by step guidance so that I could get confidence. Yes. Yep. Cool. All right. So then you got everything on that one call. Yep. You Got everything you needed and you got the resources, which you, you know, said, okay, I can use the sleep lady shuffle.
And so then you went on your own and you sleep trained your son. Yep. So then let's kind of go to the next iteration. So now you solved this. So then one conversation helped me do what I needed to do. It got him sleeping. Awesome. Then what happened? Then we hit what, again, what Google has told me was their third sleep regression,
third year I think is what it was called. The third sleep regression. And again, you're at a loss, right? You're just like, because new stage altogether, he is mobile now in many different ways. Potty train, bed, train, I shouldn't say train, but he, he's, yeah. You know, potty doing potty training, you know,
bed, bed training. So again, it's just a, a whole new ball game. Right. And again, I'm just like, I don't even know where to start. There's so many elements to this now that I don't even know where to begin. So I think because I already knew where I could go, I didn't quite panic. It was more just like,
okay, let me see if I can figure this out on my own. I, I think I told you since too, I give myself a time limit. If I cannot figure this out within four weeks, I'm not messing with it. I'm going to the source again, that can guide me as what can I do? Give me the steps, give me the steps to where I can help him get through this better,
because that's not working for me clearly. Yeah. And then we did another call. So then we did a call. Yep. I think another call Eight months ago, I think it was. Yeah. And then what happened? So at that point was that, I think at that point, that's when, oh no, it wasn't that long ago.
But at that point, what I was at the point where just like, okay, I'm at this new phase with him. What do I do? How do I help him? What am I doing wrong? Because again, I Oh yeah. So you were the one that kind of helped me guide in the steps of him learning how to do bedtime because it was like a whole new thing.
Like, it's not just like putting them down and he can put himself Yeah. It's like a bed bedtime with a, in the big boy bed. Yes. It was, it was learning how to introduce him to bedtime. That's where we're Yep. How, how I help introduce bedtime to him. And that's where, again, all of those steps came into play for me.
What to get to help him, what to make to help him, how to get that routine of bedtime instilled in his brain, which I think wasn't that difficult for me because of talking to you beforehand. I still had a good grasp of, like, I've always maintained a bed bedtime with, with him. I set a time doing whatever I do.
So I wasn't too hard, but it was just like a new different type of thing for both me and him. Right. So that started to go, went well. He understood it. And then probably a couple, probably about a month ago, again, I hit a different, a different plane with him. That was him wanting to come to the door,
knew want, he wanted more cuddles type of a situation. And that's where it led to, again, now a different stage of him understanding, you know, I'm still here, but now it's bedtime for you. So that's kind of where I'm at now. The, the whole getting him to understand like, I'm still in the house with you. You're not missing much,
but it is bedtime. So, yeah, That's, yeah. So, okay, so that's, so again, so then I'll be like, okay, so we did the strategy session, then when did you call me again? Okay. The introduction to the big boy bed and really making sure that that was successful. Okay. Yeah. Then, then,
then what happened? Okay. Then we have a whole bunch of new behaviors that are common to three year olds that are, you know, the stalling and the requesting and all of that. And I was like, again, I gave myself the deadline and then I was like, Nope, I'm calling Joanna. And we got that solved. So that's,
that's like a really good evolution. So then I'll, I guess I'll say is, I guess another good question would be, okay, well this is interesting. I, this just popped in my head, so I don't know if this is even a good question to ask you, but let's just, let me just test it out and see what happens.
Knowing that you've had so much success, having me as your support person for sleep, knowing you can always call me knowing that I will be here. Why do you think so many moms don't call? Why do you think so many moms continue to suffer and Google and complain and don't ask for the support? I dunno. Because I'll, you know, honestly,
I, I, it was almost just like, no, you know, I will figure this out. And that could have been my, so the second time when I decided like, I need to call, I need some help and guidance, because I'm not figuring it out. I'm not sure if it's a mindset of just like, you know, I'm so far along in this,
I should be able to figure this out. Oh. So I don't, I'm wondering if that's what it was, because I did think about that. I'm like, I should be able to figure this out. Right? We've gone so long doing so well, maybe there's just a couple of kinks that I need to figure out. You know, again,
he's growing older, he's developing something different. You know, I should be able to figure this out. So I dunno if maybe it's that mindset, and then it could also be also something where it's just like, you kind of feel like I'm falling back. Right? Like, I, I, I, like, I've been doing so well now,
now he's throwing me a curve ball. I, you know, I, now I feel like I'm, I'm taking another step back. So I don't know if maybe that's the feeling of like a mom, I should say. Like, kind of like, maybe like a little bit of like shame and disappointment. Yeah. And so before you kind of like,
don't wanna be like, call somebody and ask for help because you're like, I know I caused this, but can you help Me? Exactly. Almost just like, Hey, it's me again. I'm in this situation again. Can you maybe help me out? Almost kind of like that, you know, you're just like, ugh, almost. Maybe not feeling defeated.
That's not the word that I, but almost feeling just like, ugh, man, I got, you know, I'm, you feel like back at square one, you're just like, oh man, I'm back at square one. Knowing that you're just like, okay, I have to call and again, get those steps of how to rearrange this. So it's almost maybe like that mindset of just like I have to,
I'm gonna start from the beginning type of a thing. Oh yeah. Again, just that's kind of like the second time around. You're just like, oh man, I know this is, Maybe, it's almost like a little bit of like dread. It's like, oh no, this is gonna be hard. I'm gonna have to do this again. I don't wanna do this.
This is a pain. Yeah. Lemme think about like, some things that I can maybe do that are just gonna solve this really easily. 'cause I don't really wanna have to do the whole thing. Exactly. Yeah. Yep. You kind of get into that mindset. But then I think like, the more you, for me it was, the more I prolong it and try to do it myself,
I'm just like, I am just, I'm becoming more miserable and trying to figure this out. So it's like, why am I doing this to myself? I know the resources is sitting right there staring at me at the, in the face. I get the emails popped up all the time. I know how to get ahold of her. Why am I prolonging it?
And that's when you're just like, I'm gonna jump. 'cause yes, you know what I'll have to do to help him will again take some time. And you have to redevelop. But it, but the reward of it is that he gets to sleep, he goes to bed. So it's just almost like plain mind, you know, tag tag in your head.
You're just like, why are you prolonging it? So that's when I jumped. Yeah. So let me toss something out. I often feel like sleep training is a lot like being on a diet, right? Like, it's like this feeling like, you're doing great, you're doing great, you're doing great. You go on a vacation, next thing you know there's three pounds.
The next thing you know there's five pounds. Next thing you know, there's seven pounds. And you're like, oh no. Yeah. Now I'm gonna have to do something about this. But there's like this feeling like, I don't wanna have to do this. This is gonna be, but you know, you have to do it. So then there's this like negotiation of like,
when are you gonna do it? How are you gonna do it? Are you gonna do it alone? Are you gonna do it with help? Like, are you gonna dabble around? That's exactly, that's a very well way to put it, because that's exactly how it feels. Exactly how it feels. You just know you need to dive into it.
But again, it's the, like him, it's the stalling. You're just like, Ugh, maybe tomorrow I'll start this tomorrow. Tomorrow. And then before you know it, it's four weeks in, you're just like, oh my gosh, I feel more, I feel worse than I did in the beginning. I know, it's true. And I,
I, I mean, I, and what I mean by that is like, like us humans, right? We're just so silly. Yeah. We really are. I mean like we Create our own annoyances. Yeah, yeah. Yep. Our, our hardship. Yep. It could. Yeah, exactly. It definitely does. Oh my gosh. Okay.
So I think that was a good question. I think I should ask you that question because Ly It is, it is exactly what happens. And I think I wanna break the myth of you don't have to do it alone and maybe it's not as hard to, to solve as you thought it was. Like the delay actually made it harder to solve it.
Yes. Yes. That's a good way to, yeah, the delay. 'cause at that point then you're like totally like annoyed with yourself. You're annoyed with your kid and you're annoyed with yourself. Just like if you gained, you could have stopped at two pounds, you could have stopped at five pounds. Now you gotta stop it at seven pounds and you're just like extra annoyed with yourself 'cause you're like,
I literally just made this harder. Absolutely. Yeah. And then I think too, because it's like, it comes outta nowhere sometimes you're just like, what is happening? We were doing so good. And then it just comes outta nowhere. I think that also goes with the facts where the delay happens, how some people wait 'cause you're just like, well,
maybe it's just a fluke. Right? Yeah. So I like, maybe if I give it a little bit more tweak, a little bit more, I can get 'em back on track. And it, it's like the whole diet thing where you're just like, you delay your delay, your delay, and before you know it again, you're like months in sleep deprived,
you're both frustrated with each other. It's that that's, it's like, why, why wait when you could have solved this months ago? Yeah. Okay. I love that. That's the, we're totally gonna talk about that. So, yeah, so, so I think what our cadence is gonna be know, why'd you first call me? You know,
kind of we're emphasizing 'cause you weren't a one-on-one client. That's why I wanted to talk to you. 'cause it's such a great story. Like some people think, all right, either I need a sleep consultant or I don't. Right. Right. Which is kind of this like, but what your story says is like, yeah, I never needed her from one-on-one coaching,
but I needed her at each step of the way because she was so good at giving me the steps that I could then implement them myself and be successful. But I always knew I had a safety net. Yes. And that it doesn't have to be this black and white thing where you're either like, full blown sleep training or full blown doing it alone.
So yeah. So I'll ask kinda like how it started. When was the next time, when was the next time? And then this like, well why do you suppose people knowing that you've had this support with me over these years? 'cause how, how old, how old's your son now? Is he three and a half or Three and a half?
Yeah, a little. A little over three and a half. Yeah. That you, you, you know, you realize you had the safety net. Why do you suppose people don't? And I think that you, that this whole thing of like, first it starts off as maybe it's a fluke. Let me just try a couple things and see if I can tweak it.
And then it evolves into, well I can definitely figure this out. I should be able to figure this out. I should put the next phase. Yeah. And then you're like, then the next phase becomes like, oh, I'm really falling back. I, I am now, I'm feeling a lot of, It's almost like dread like me. You're like,
you're like this. You're like, oh, it's me again. Like now, then you're afraid to ask for help because you're kinda like, I did this. It's me again. So then there's like that Yes. Shame. And then the next phase is kind of like, now I'm becoming more miserable and I'm not liking myself or the kid. So now I have to ask for help That I could have.
I could have Avoided that whole process of Yes, I could have. I had just in the first week And just went straight to the source and then everyone been happy. So yeah. Yeah. Okay. So that would be really cool. Okay. So then, then my last question will be, okay, if you met a tired mom or if you met a tired,
if you met a tired mom or dad today, what would you want them to know about working with a sleep consultant? That it is worth it. It's worth everything to have someone verbally help you. I mean, you could go, you can go and Google and read everything you want. No judgment there. If you find what you need, great.
But why put yourself through something that will take you down a a rabbit hole when you have something right there staring at you in the face. Like I could not tell anybody. Like one, because sleep is important. Sleep is important for you and sleep is important for your kiddo. So if you have the resource staring right in front of you, why not take it?
Yeah, exactly. Perfect. That. And, and I had, and I'll just, I might even like add this on 'cause I thought it was, it was such an interesting perspective. I have a second time client I just finished with. So first client, she had their first baby in Covid. And you know, no help. I mean,
you know that you couldn't get the lactation consultant, you couldn't, you couldn't bring, you know, your husband couldn't come to the pediatrician appointment, so your husband couldn't even be in the room when you were delivered. Right. So she had no help and, and she and her child had a medical condition. So the no help verdict was just like extra miserable.
Oh. And now she had a second baby just recently. No, no. Lots of services. She's like, so I have had the, the no help zone and the, you can have any help you want zone. And I cannot believe the difference in my quality of life between the no help zone and the help zone. In the help zone.
Yeah. In the Help zone. And I kind of am like, whenever I meet a mom, I'm like, ask for help. Ask for ask, ask for everywhere. Everywhere, everywhere. Ask, ask, ask. Because you, you, you have the opportunity. Now you didn't that we didn't that No Long ago. So I thought that was kind of interesting 'cause I was like,
oh my God, you're right. It was the no help and the help like it is with two different worlds. And that's perfectly said. And I can word this as well be it is the, I find with some people it's, they don't wanna talk about the struggles because all they wanna talk about is how perfect. Right. And sometimes I wanna be like,
I wanna verbalize, I'm like, it can't be that perfect. Right? You have like, the struggle had to have been there summer. Right? All I'm hearing is the perfection. So it makes me re weary to be like, well, did you struggle with this because I did as well. And if so, are you gonna tell me the truth so we can like talk about that?
'cause maybe what you did try can work for me as well. Like that's what I find now as a new mom is that when I look back all of these other, it's just, they all wanna, even with social media, that's the other thing too, that was like a big trigger during the no sleep phase. It's like all you see are these posts of people just like,
look how perfect this is working for me. I know, I know. Like, well how come this isn't working for me? So I think that's the thing too, is like be being honest. Like if anybody ever came up and be like, do not, why struggle when help is right there Yeah. Waiting for you. Like I, that that's why like there was no hesitation when it's just like,
I need help. I am not gonna struggle because I know it's there waiting for me. Okay. So I think that's what you just said was super, we should include that about kind of like the no judgment zone. So like, you're kind of like, like this, like, okay, so here you are, you're like a new mom, you're kind of flooded with images of perfection.
Like everyone's having a great time. Everyone's nursing successfully, everybody's nursery looks so great, everybody's like going to play dates or whatever, and you're struggling. And then you don't really know who you can ask about what's going on. And then if you do, you're trying to get to know them, so you don't really know if they're telling you the truth.
Right. So then when you go talk to a professional, you know it's a no judgment zone, right? Yeah. Which is like, I came out of this fear of sharing what's going on because I would've possibly felt judged because if it's truly true that the perfectionism that they're showing me is really, that's their reality. Meaning they're really quite having a lovely experience in this parenting thing.
Like they, their nursery really is clean all the time. Right. And the nursing relationship is really fabulous. Then I feel like a big fat loser. And so if I can go talk to a professional and feel like I have a no judgment zone, I need that because my vulnerability is, is too great when I try to talk to, you know,
when there's this perfectionism, like Yeah. Like, yeah, like Overlay. Yep. Okay. All right. So this is awesome. So I'm gonna stop the recording now. Okay.